Talk:Heart of a Champion (3.5e Maneuver)

Ratings

	Leziad opposes this article and rated it 0 of 4.
	One 3rd level at-will ability can deal with pretty much anything? Ability Drain? Negative Level? Yeah.... Honestly I would probably favor this if some of the craziness was removed. But as it is, just a better Iron Heart Surge, which didn't need to be better.

	Eiji-kun is neutral on this article and rated it 2 of 4.
	As a maneuver which clarifies and replaces IHS, it is good, but the move action use is a straight buff I am not comfortable with. Out of all the maneuvers that need buffing, IHS is not one of those. IHS is used as an example of top tier maneuvers.

	MisterSinister favors this article and rated it 4 of 4!
	Finally, an Iron Heart Surge that doesn't make being stunned such a problem, but that also doesn't let vampires 'end' the sun. Ten thumbs up.

Ability Burn

I just noticed ability burn was on there. That seems unwise, burn was the one "this is serious" permanent thing that expressly could not be healed unnaturally, and it opens things up for all sorts of abuse.

On a side note, out of curiosity, why did you make it a move instead of a standard action anyway? I figured the standard action cost was an intentional nerf to its usefulness. -- Eiji-kun (talk) 06:15, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

I may have to think a bit on ability burn, but since this can get you out of most of the important save-or-suck effects like paralysis, blinding, etc. I figure simply from a power perspective one won't be that focused on ability burn. That said, I can't think of many monsters off the top of my head that inflict ability burn as a condition, leaving that mostly to classes that self-inflict it in return for class features. As for the move action, that was mostly to make it fit as a Rush since previously it was one of those funky unclassified maneuvers. Since it removes everything that affects you at once and the morale bonus can't stack, there is zero incentive to use it multiple times per turn. That's admittedly not much of a concern, but making it a move action makes it much more versatile, which I personally think is a good thing.

I think the crux of the issue is that I do not have an intended balance level here (it would be Very High). Given that, I feel as though use of this particular maneuver (and spending half your turn to use it, essentially) is not that big of a deal for the level at which it would be used. - TG Cid (talk) 12:29, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

Ability burn is used often enough as a cost with a slow recharge time that it would be unreasonable to have a power that cures ability burn if you wouldn't also consider letting it cure "spell slots used". --Foxwarrior (talk) 19:26, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

Foxwarrior++. Burn is almost always a player paid cost to power their own stuff. It should not be a curable condition IMO. - Tarkisflux ^Talk 22:02, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

Hilarious

Fuck you, I unbroke my spine! -SecondDeath777 17:09, 11 November 2017